So usually these clone systems are pretty cheap and bad, but the RetroN5 looks pretty promising. Apparently it is a little emulation based, making it better than the inaccurate clones to come out before it. It has five cartridge slots. It supports the NES, SNES, Genesis, GBA, and Famicom. It has HDMI and upconverts video to 720p. It has two NES ports, two Genesis, and two SNES, in addition to a universal controller it comes with.
Here's what it looks like:
(http://www.digitpress.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6465&d=1364176006)
I'll have to see what others say about it when it comes out this summer, but hopefully this will be good. Haven't found any clone better than the RetroDuo, and that came out five years ago.
but i can do all of this better with a pc hooked up to my tv
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 02:06:14 PM
but i can do all of this better with a pc hooked up to my tv
Some people want to use their actual cartridges.
those people have actual consoles
Its real goal is to give retro game stores a new stock of systems that they can sell to people who just want to play SMB3 on a console again.
Oh, and there are people who collect clone systems.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 02:52:29 PM
Its real goal is to give retro game stores a new stock of systems that they can sell to people who just want to play SMB3 on a console again.
no legitimate store sells poop like this they're just as illegal as emulators
and any people that would be satisfied by this would be just as satisfied by those emulators.
These aren't illegal. They've been legal in the US since 2005 when Nintendo's copyright on the NES lapsed. I got mine at Play N Trade.
Emulators aren't illegal, either. ROMs from games you don't own are illegal yes, but emulators aren't. And ROMs of games you personally own are completely legal as well.
The kind of people who just up and decide "I want to play SMB3 again" aren't the kind that would set up emulators anyway.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 03:33:16 PM
These aren't illegal. They've been legal in the US since 2005 when Nintendo's copyright on the NES lapsed. I got mine at Play N Trade.
that may be true, though patent is the word you're looking for, and it certainly doesnt apply to every console this thing plays.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 03:33:16 PM
Emulators aren't illegal, either. ROMs from games you don't own are illegal yes, but emulators aren't. And ROMs of games you personally own are completely legal as well.
No and no. well i suppose the patent thing applies here, but emulating protected hardware/software is just as illegal as building it. and software purchases have never been universal. It doesn't matter if you own SMB3, you bought the right to play it on an NES, not the right to play it wherever you want.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 03:33:16 PM
The kind of people who just up and decide "I want to play SMB3 again" aren't the kind that would set up emulators anyway.
But they are the type to spend more time and money going out to some niche game store to buy something like this?
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 03:03:08 PM
no legitimate store sells poop like this they're just as illegal as emulators
and any people that would be satisfied by this would be just as satisfied by those emulators.
zeph confirmed for retarded
the patents and poop for these old consoles expired ages ago
go to any play n' trade and you can find things like the retro duo and the supaboy no problem.
Nintendo lost a case in the 90s over this and the precedent now is that you can legally rip games/systems that you own for personal use. Been like that for over twenty years now.
Emulators are in fact legal. It's just pirated ROMs that aren't.
And yes, they would be likely to spend more time and money to go out to a niche store to buy this.
i always thought that if nintendo spent a little money to start reproducing retro carts, they'd make a buttload of money.
we have collectors that would kill to get their hands on some of these carts that don't care if they're not original runs, we have the entire retro-nostalgic crowd, and we have plenty of people who are buying these remade combination consoles.
they wouldnt have to make a continual release, but a one time event of releasing cartridges would sell out like intercourse ing crazy, especially if they did it with the more expensive games like earthbound
I'd personally enjoy that but they'd have to put "REPRODUCTION" on it everywhere so it wouldn't be confused for original copies. Especially with games like Earthbound.
Sadly, many of the parts used to make SNES cartridges are out of production. We've gone past the point where it would be cheap to make a lot of cartridges since there's lots of unused parts laying around. We're now at the point where the parts needed to make these cartridges aren't being made anymore.
It makes more sense for them to release games digitally. It sucks, but I don't think they'd ever remake the carts.
Quote from: The Riddler on March 25, 2013, 04:29:15 PM
zeph confirmed for retarded
the patents and poop for these old consoles expired ages ago
go to any play n' trade and you can find things like the retro duo and the supaboy no problem.
sorry i dont follow patent law and the entire stock of one used game chain
but no the nes is the only one of those consoles that is out of patent.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 04:34:24 PM
Nintendo lost a case in the 90s over this and the precedent now is that you can legally rip games/systems that you own for personal use. Been like that for over twenty years now.
this changed with the DMCA, any copyright precedent prior to that is irrelevant.
of course nobody's going to do anything about any of this, it would cost them more to fight it than they'd lose in sales.
FC Twin System
Retro Duo and all updates
Retron and all updates
Hyperkin Supaboy
this stuff has been on actual store shelves for a while.
The NES, SNES, Famicom and Genesis are all out of patent.
DMCA allows you to rip games you own, but forbids you from circumventing any sort of copy protection scheme.
In any case, none of the companies care as long as their games aren't included. Sega even licenses their games to be in some Genesis clones.
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 04:58:10 PM
DMCA allows you to rip games you own, but forbids you from circumventing any sort of copy protection scheme.
hardware restrictions are copy protection.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 05:03:07 PM
hardware restrictions are copy protection.
That's not the kind of copy protection it refers to. It refers to things like DRM and other forms of software lockout.
What happened to
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 02:06:14 PM
but i can do all of this better with a pc hooked up to my tv
anyway?
Quote from: Tupin on March 25, 2013, 05:12:11 PM
That's not the kind of copy protection it refers to. It refers to things like DRM and other forms of software lockout.
If you're doing anything with the copy that you couldn't do with the original you've violated the DMCA
and i do plenty of illegal poop, but i dont argue that its not illegal. i brought this up to counter the argument that clone consoles are somehow more legitimate than emulators.
collectors want the real thing, everyone else is either fine with emulators or too stupid to figure out how they work. i guess that's the market for this poop.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 03:03:08 PM
no legitimate store sells poop like this they're just as illegal as emulators
and any people that would be satisfied by this would be just as satisfied by those emulators.
you're an idiot go outside have you never been to a game store that isn't target or gamestop?
these things are literally everywhere and since real NES consoles are all intercourse ing broken i appreciate them
why would i go to any real store the internet exists
Quote from: zephilicious on March 25, 2013, 10:49:40 PM
why would i go to any real store the internet exists
(http://laptopgardener.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/HomeOutsidePg.47centerright.jpg)
(http://www.nassauparadiseisland.com/photos/image/?format=raw&type=img&id=406)
(http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101130191051/coasterpedia/images/1/1a/AmusementPark.jpg)
(http://blog.sifteo.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/awardprint.jpg)
(http://s3-media4.ak.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/FGflGCW7YC6V_CoNNjTGow/l.jpg)
cool stores there bro
These new "retro" clone units do not sell very well. At least around here. I must have seen two or three get sold back in my PnT days. So Zeph is probably right that the market barely exists for these things.
Though what I don't get is why the legality of these things is called into question. Not to be their PR guy but Play N Trade does not sell illegal products. PnT sells replacement "retroclone" consoles only for things like the NES and SNES. These clone consoles may interpret cartridge data differently than the original consoles or whatever but even if they didn't I somehow doubt it'd be a problem. These retroduo systems don't break any laws and some of them are pretty sweet because some can play PAL games. If you're a collector and can't be chaffed to find a PAL NES/SNES, that is quite a perk.
You don't see them selling any clones of the PS1 or Saturn because not only is the demand even lower than the SNES/NES market, but at the end of the day it wouldn't surprise me if Sony/SEGA still owned some portion of what makes the originals tick, like the BIOS' for example. I have never seen a non-SNES/NES clone console at a PnT. Ever.
Quote from: Z on March 26, 2013, 05:46:47 AM
These new "retro" clone units do not sell very well. At least around here. I must have seen two or three get sold back in my PnT days. So Zeph is probably right that the market barely exists for these things.
The appeal of a system that plays old games is lost on me. Yes, playing Red/Blue or Ruby/Sapphire would be great again. Maybe booting up an old Mario or Ninja Turtles game would be fun. But for the most part I think that these games live better in nostalgia than in playing them years later. When I think of playing old Pokemon games, for example, I think about how playing them was untarnished by all this "EVsIVsShiniesBreedingforpowerBeBetterBeStrongerNoFunLookupOnlineKnowEverything" that's rampant today. Fuck, I had a Prima Games strategy guide for most of them, but that didn't ruin it to the point that worrying about proper levelling and type balancing has (when I was young I was content to just level the intercourse out of Charizard and then use MissingNo on everything else).
So I feel like nostalgia gaming is kinda beyond the point. Technological advancements have been made. It's better in some cases, worse in others. This obviously doesn't apply to every game - I'd still intercourse ing love to play Earthbound or Mother or any game that's awesome I never had a chance to play. But I feel like it's just something not worth the trouble.
I agree with you. Still, I replay old games all the time.
Just play Pokemon without the competitive bullpoop in mind. It isn't like you need it to beat the games anyway.
Quote from: Viewtlfulboy on March 27, 2013, 12:57:12 AM
I'd still intercourse ing love to play Earthbound or Mother or any game that's awesome I never had a chance to play. But I feel like it's just something not worth the trouble.
so go intercourse ing play them you dont need a console for this.
i play old games far far more often than new games. its not nostalgia, they're darn good games. But I'm not buying a fake console to do it when my pc is already every fake console ever conceived.
[spoiler]my oldschool backlog is huge[/spoiler]
I mean intercourse I still haven't touched Secret of Mana or Terranigma.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 10:24:35 AM
so go intercourse ing play them you dont need a console for this.
i play old games far far more often than new games. its not nostalgia, they're darn good games. But I'm not buying a fake console to do it when my pc is already every fake console ever conceived.
why are you so upset about everything
like really
are you mad that people aren't joining you in pc gaming or something
my pc can run everything but i'd rather play the real carts
don't know what to tell you kid
maybe you just don't have $$$$ or something
sorry you cant differentiate argument and anger thats gotta make life hard
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 10:58:02 AM
sorry you cant differentiate argument and anger thats gotta make life hard
yeah what great arguments you're making
a fun system is coming out and you're just coming in this thread and you keep just talking about how great emulating games on your pc is (hey, everyone knows about emulation this isn't groundbreaking buddy)
man you're really showing everyone i'm not going to buy this convenient piece of hardware to play sega and snes games on now
also go read your old posts
still sounds bitter and upset over nothing
why are you even arguing in this thread
why do you even care
but youre not going to buy this hardware
not because i convinced you of anything but because its a pointless device. that was the argument.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 11:10:21 AM
but youre not going to buy this hardware
not because i convinced you of anything but because its a pointless device. that was the argument.
why am i not going to buy this
i think it's a good idea
it's only $100 and the nes jess and I own hardly words and i really don't want to get another one of those
my sega is a pain to hook up and the visual quality is pretty bad due to me only having the old setup where you hook it through your cable and change it to channel 2 (no idea what that poop's called)
jess keeps the snes most of the time but if i had this i could play tetris attack and dkc1 often
it's pretty convenient
plus i don't have to keep switching around consoles anymore when i want to play something else
and if you reply saying "WELL YEAH YOU CAN DO ALL THIS ON YOUR PC" then you're bitter and upset about something friend
it's not your money, why do you care?
lets take a step back
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 10:43:33 AM
my pc can run everything but i'd rather play the real carts
why? what do carts do better?
I get the argument that the real thing is better, be it the physical aspect of it, or the nostalgia, or whatever, but as I see it, a fake console is no longer the real thing.
so then we're left with what? cost? convenience? legality?
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 11:34:41 AM
lets take a step back
why? what do carts do better?
I get the argument that the real thing is better, be it the physical aspect of it, or the nostalgia, or whatever, but as I see it, a fake console is no longer the real thing.
so then we're left with what? cost? convenience? legality?
it's not that carts are better, it's more that they're the real deal.
it's called i have 80 snes and genesis carts laying around and i don't want them to just sit on my shelf
plus this is easier for me
you may love mapping your controllers and finding emulators that don't completely intercourse up the sound of games (snes9x sucks my dick) but i'd rather just buy something and hit an on switch (before you get mad we're just assuming the RetroN5 system does in fact play these games perfectly it might end up being poop who knows until it comes out)
i also like the idea of having a collection and putting it to use
same reason i like cds and vinyls
nobody is going to be impressed when you show them 30,000 songs on winamp, anyone can download poop
but a cool record collection is a cool record collection
i didn't throw all of my cds away when itunes came out
i'm not going to throw all my carts away that i still enjoy playing
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 11:47:58 AM
same reason i like cds and vinyls
perfect lets use that metaphor.
now maybe this doesnt apply to you, but most people that collect cds, rip them to their computer once, then stick them on a shelf. they still have the cd and a nice collection to show off, but they dont actually use the cd to listen to music. same goes for vinyl with ripping replaced by download codes, or illegal methods for older records.
i treat video games the same way. I've got a shelf full of old games, and all the consoles hooked up to an old crt for that authentic experience. and sure, sometimes my friends and I will turn them on for the nostalgic novelty of it. but most of the time, if i want to play an snes game, even if its one i own, i'm going to opt for the convenience of booting up an emulator on the computer im already sitting at and play it there.
i dont see how that discounts the value of my collection.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 12:01:18 PM
perfect lets use that metaphor.
now maybe this doesnt apply to you, but most people that collect cds, rip them to their computer once, then stick them on a shelf. they still have the cd and a nice collection to show off, but they dont actually use the cd to listen to music. same goes for vinyl with ripping replaced by download codes, or illegal methods for older records.
i treat video games the same way. I've got a shelf full of old games, and all the consoles hooked up to an old crt for that authentic experience. and sure, sometimes my friends and I will turn them on for the nostalgic novelty of it. but most of the time, if i want to play an snes game, even if its one i own, i'm going to opt for the convenience of booting up an emulator on the computer im already sitting at and play it there.
i dont see how that discounts the value of my collection.
ok but i like to play them on the consoles
also i bought a newish vinyl player from target
emulation has its perks man
N64 games freeze up all the time. Not when you emulate them. Also better textures.
I'm regurgitating information I've already said, but really, this argument is dumb.
Quote from: Z on March 27, 2013, 01:01:06 PM
emulation has its perks man
N64 games freeze up all the time. Not when you emulate them. Also better textures.
I'm regurgitating information I've already said, but really, this argument is dumb.
i'm not saying i've never emulated anything before or something dumb like that
i'm aware
i just don't care
i like playing on consoles better
i don't know what to tell you
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 01:07:48 PM
i like playing on consoles better
im just trying to figure out why
i get the authenticity argument, but in my mind that wouldnt carry over to a fake console
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 01:13:48 PM
im just trying to figure out why
i get the authenticity argument, but in my mind that wouldnt carry over to a fake console
it does for me
i dunno
i guess as long as i'm still using the carts it feels authentic and i don't really care about things like the nes becuase all of my components for it are broken
i'd rather use a better 3rd party console than the official console with like a poopty 3rd party controller or like a broken standard controller
i'd rather play sonic adventure on gamecube than on steam or dreamcast, but i still play all the versions
i'm just a weird guy
hi
collector here
playing a game on an emulator is not the same as playing it on a poopty old tv with it's original controller after blowing in the cartridge.
may sound silly but the nostalgia is worth it.
only time i use emulators is for games i can't obtain due to money constraints/no english version, and even then i'm looking into reproduction carts
Quote from: The Riddler on March 27, 2013, 03:25:48 PM
hi
collector here
playing a game on an emulator is not the same as playing it on a poopty old tv with it's original controller after blowing in the cartridge.
Scanning through the thread, I can't see anyone actually claiming the contrary man.
From a technical standpoint, something like ZSNES is superior. That's pretty much the only vibe I see that resembles anything like opposition to what you guys are saying.
And I agree with it. ZSNES can simulate scanlines. Not having a cart just means you're saving time getting the darn game to work.
Quote from: The Riddler on March 27, 2013, 03:25:48 PM
hi
collector here
playing a game on an emulator is not the same as playing it on a poopty old tv with it's original controller after blowing in the cartridge.
the only one of those things you cant do with an emulator is the last one.
but really, i agree. the point is you're losing most of that with a fake console, and if you're going with a fake console because its a little more convenient or whatever why not go all the way?
i really don't think using an emulator is more convenient
maybe you guys just have terrible gaming setups
how is it not more convenient?
first time set up takes maybe twice as long as plugging in a console.
after that i can have any game on any console up and running in 3 clicks without leaving my chair.
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 05:19:51 PM
how is it not more convenient?
first time set up takes maybe twice as long as plugging in a console.
after that i can have any game on any console up and running in 3 clicks without leaving my chair.
that's why i'm saying it might just be my setup
i have 3 systems near me at all times (right now it's n64, gamecube, ps2)
i can press a button and turn on the tv faster than my 5 clicks + getting out usb to ___ controller dongle
taking a game and finding a rom take about the same time for me (roms are unorganized due to downloading in huge packs, games are all in alphabetical order about a room away)
also what controllers do you guys use for emulators
i have usb to ps2, gamecube, wii classic controller (classic pro is the best for old poop), and recently acquired a wired 360 controller to use for poop
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 04:49:14 PM
i really don't think using an emulator is more convenient
maybe you guys just have terrible gaming setups
It takes a single click for me to open up a NES, SNES, dual GBC/GBA, dual GBA/DS, Genesis, Game Gear, PS1, PS2, Dreamcast, Saturn, or dual Gamecube/Wii emulator, ETC and one more click to choose a game.
How is that not immensely convenient? I'm not trying to argue that my gaming setup is good. I just have no idea how anyone could argue against emulation being convenient. Everything is in one place.
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 05:24:39 PM
also what controllers do you guys use for emulators
i have usb to ps2, gamecube, wii classic controller (classic pro is the best for old poop), and recently acquired a wired 360 controller to use for poop
Bluetooth PS3 controller. Works great for most emulators.
Quote from: Z on March 27, 2013, 05:30:56 PM
It takes a single click for me to open up a NES, SNES, dual GBC/GBA, dual GBA/DS, Genesis, Game Gear, PS1, PS2, Dreamcast, Saturn, or dual Gamecube/Wii emulator, ETC and one more click to choose a game.
How is that not immensely convenient? I'm not trying to argue that my gaming setup is good. I just have no idea how anyone could argue against emulation being convenient. Everything is in one place.
Bluetooth PS3 controller. Works great for most emulators.
with my setup it's not as convenient for playing a single game
as i usually don't switch between games on a certain console constantly
like dragon quest for example
it's easier for me to just hit the switch and grab the controller
i know it's in there
it's easier htan clicking and finding the rom and all that
but for like nes gmaes where i don't really give a poop what i'm playing emulators are more convenient
plus the nes jess and i have is in the other room
plus that dog bone controller SUX
plus it hardly works
almost every emulator ever gives you a list of recently played games
Quote from: zephilicious on March 27, 2013, 05:45:01 PM
almost every emulator ever gives you a list of recently played games
yeah i know i use them
still easier for me to turn on my ps2
Quote from: Custom on March 27, 2013, 05:38:58 PM
with my setup it's not as convenient for playing a single game
as i usually don't switch between games on a certain console constantly
like dragon quest for example
it's easier for me to just hit the switch and grab the controller
i know it's in there
it's easier htan clicking and finding the rom and all that
I organize my emulation folders, and windows/emulators usually make it easy by having it open right up to the last directory you opened up to.
you don't lose as much nostalgia with a fake console as you do emulator.
i brought a buddy of mine to play n trade when he wanted an SNES, but i saw that the retron which played both NES and SNES was only about 10 dollars more than the SNES. he doesn't collect, he just wanted the ability to play, so i told him to get the retron. now he gets to play his games on a poopty old tv, blow in his cartridges, and use his classic controllers
but with the convenience of being able to play both NES and SNES
I don't mind using emulators, but I much prefer to play games on the console they were designed for. I have emotional attachments to the original consoles, like my SNES and my N64. There's a certain kind of magic in playing on the original poop.